CATHY ANSCHUTZ AND HER INTERVIEW WITH VERA HOLZER
Cathy Anschutz and Her Interview with Vera Holzer
I've known Vera for many years. We were both born and raised in Seymour, only she preceded me by about 30 years. My most vivid memory of her is in the capacity of child care. She had an excellent reputation for babysitting and could often be seen heading to the park with the children holding hands as they followed her. As I interviewed her I was impressed with her memory and the changes that she recalled taking place during her lifetime in Seymour.
1. How long have you lived in Seymour?
Vera - One hundred years and six months.
2. Where were you born?
I was born in Seymour in the house on the northeast corner of West Factory Street and Lincoln Street. Going west from Main there was the restaurant, Boyden's house, Kailhofer's house then us. It was the little white one on the corner.
3. Tell me about your family?
My parents were Jay Sherwood and Sadie Sherwood. She was Sadie Smith. I had six brothers and sisters. Roy was the oldest and Glen was the youngest. The Sherwood family has roots that go back to the early settlement of Seymour including the Mungers and Gardners. I've been told that I have ancestors on the Sherwood side who came to America on the Mayflower.
4. How long did you live in that house.
Until I got married: Then we moved to the farm in the Isaar area on Holzer Road.
5. Did you work on the farm?
Absolutely! My husband's parents had a 185 acre farm and I didn't know anything about farming. I didn't milk but I would wash the cows and get hay down. I remember one time I got second crop hay down and used it for bedding. I didn't know the difference between hay and straw. My husband wasn't very happy with me. I think that was the only time he was upset with me as long as we were married. I said, 'Don't get mad at me, I didn't grow up on a farm and you never showed me the difference between straw and hay.'
6. When you were a little girl what kinds of things did you do for fun?
We played hopscotch, roller skated, played Annie, Annie over the barn and rode bike. My brother Roy worked for Kuehne's and he bought a used bike. We took turns riding it. We played many different games and I had my chores, cooking and dish washing. My sister was supposed to do the laundry, but nine times out of ten I ended up doing it. They would say 'Shorty can do it.' That was my nickname.
7. What did your dad do?
He worked at the Woodenware.
When my mom and dad first got married he worked at Hallada's Meat Market . He did something wrong
with one of the machines and ended up cutting his hand off. After that he worked at the Woodenware, but didn't get paid as much as others because he only had one hand. He was told to keep the stump warm and he should be OK. In the wintertime my grandma would knit mittens and he always kept it covered. The doctors preserved his hand in a jar and it was kept upstairs in the house. I remember when he died. He had a heart attack by the post office on East Wisconsin Street on his way to work. I believe he was in his seventies. Then they buried his hand with him.
8. Did your mother have a long life?
Unfortunately, she was in a car accident when she was in her forties. My brother Glen was taking her to Appleton when somebody pulled out in front of them and he couldn't stop. She went through the windshield and was severely injured. She was never the same after that. I remember helping care for her.
9. What other things do you remember growing up?
I remember going to the Seymour Theater. It cost ten cents a ticket. I went to school with Jean Piehl. Her dad owned Miller-Piehl Lumber and my husband, Johnny worked for them when we moved to town. She had a birthday party and her dad was going to pick us all up. That was a real treat because I didn't get to go to the movies very often. I was surprised when my dad came in the theater and picked me up because I was supposed to be babysitting. I was so excited about going to the movie evidently I forgot! I was so mad at my dad because I missed the rest of the movie. I still remember it was something about Cinderella.
I didn't like babysitting at that particular place because the father would often come home drunk and chase me. When he came in the door, I was out the door. I also used to babysit for a family down by the Woodenware and of course with all the railroad tracks it was dangerous because I had to walk there. Sometimes they didn't come home until 2:00 in the morning and often he was drunk. I was only 11 or 12 years old and I had to walk home. It was dark so I would usually run to Main Street where there was some light. Sometimes I didn't get paid because I was in such a hurry to get out of there. I also cleaned houses when I was that young. I always loved babies. I spoke with Doloris Pingel and told her I used to babysit Harold because his mother lived right across the street. The next time I saw him He said, "You used to babysit me!"
10. So how many kids did you end up babysitting for in your entire career?
Well, I remember one time the number got up to 200. I babysat as long as I can remember and I remember getting ten cents an hour during the early days. I gave my earnings to my mom because that was part of the family income. Of course my mom didn't work outside the home because she had all those kids to take care of. When my dad passed away my mom had to get a job and she worked at the canning factory. So who was going to take care of my younger brothers? Me! So I only went through my sophomore year and I had to quit school.
11. Where did you go to grade school?
I went to the big school on Robbins Street. It was a combined grade school and high school. I
started in Kindergarten there. In fact, I never missed a day. I even have a certificate to prove it. I liked
school. I wanted to graduate and become a kindergarten teacher. (Cathy- In many ways you were a teacher, you babysat and homeschooled the kids).
12. Who were your friends back then?
Oh my gosh! There were many: Jeanie Piehl, Virgie Bunkelman, Betty Otto, Carol Beck, Claude Peotter, Dannie Duffey, Buddy Trace, Nancy Hittner, oh my, Junior Brusewitz, he used to put little candy bars in my locker. He was a pretty cool kid. Emil Gosse and many from Black Creek. Claude Peotter was a good friend. He wasn't very good in arithmetic so I would help him.
13. Do you remember what classes you took when you were in high school?
My favorites were Arithmetic and English . I hated history! I liked school. It came easy for me.
14. What kind of activities did they have when you were in school?
They had archery and I was good at that. There was a contest between the boys and the girls. Emil Gosse was the best for the boys and I was the best for the girls. I remember we were in the auditorium and I had to go against Emil. Everybody thought he would win, but I beat him. if I remember nothing else from school, I remember that.
15. What teachers do you remember? I remember Mr. Reese and Mr. Loftus. They were friendly and always willing to help. When I was in the third or fourth grade I actually slapped one of my teachers. I got lice from a girl who sat behind me and I missed two weeks of school.. When I returned, the teacher insisted that I sit in my original seat. When I refused to sit by her the teacher tried to force me. That is when I slapped her and then I ran home. My grandpa was there and he took me back to school and talked to the principal, Professor Axley, and eventually the teacher was fired. She never liked me. I had to clean the blackboards every night and take out the trash
When my grandfather passed away the funeral was in his home and my sisters Opal, June, and I sang and Eleanor Tubbs played the organ. I'll never forget that.
16. Can you recall any colorful stories or characters from Seymour?
There was Wally Wingate, Dr. Finkel, he was our magician, Russell Recknagel, he was a big man but a little different. Recknagel Park was named after him. His mother had a boarding house down near
where the Municipal Building now is. Wally Wingate wore this coat with all these buttons and when there was a parade he would march along. He was a real character.
17. What memories do you have of the fair?
My dad used to park cars. We would take his lunch to him then we wouldn't have to pay to get in. June and I would go together and we always got 35 cents to spend on rides and stuff. Then we would go back by dad and he would say, 'Boy that went fast.'
One time June and I were walking around the grounds and talking and this tall man stopped us and said, 'What type of music do you like?' and I said, 'I like country music.' He asked, 'Who is your favorite country singer?' I replied, 'Johnny Cash.' He asked are you going to the show tonight?' I said, 'Oh no, I don't have any money for a ticket.' He handed me a ticket and said, 'You give that to the man at the gate and he will let you in. By the way I am Johnny Cash.' That night while he was performing he stopped and said, 'There is a young lady in the audience that I met this afternoon who is up there in the audience. If you are up there stand up and wave.' I wasn't going to stand up then June said, 'Stand up and wave.' So I did and everyone clapped.
Appleton night was on Thursday night and they had huge crowds. They had great fairs in those days. The country singers were fun. The rock and roll wasn't as good.
18. Do you remember Hamburger Charlie?
Oh yes, He had a stand with a big banner that said 'Hamburger Charlie since 1885' in big letters. He had good hamburgers. We always ate there and then we would go to the legion stand that was under the grandstand. They had cotton candy and that was a real treat.
19. Do you have any stories from the Depression years?
I remember this government truck would come around once a month to distribute flour, sugar, lard, a bag of apples that were half rotten. I hated that. You would get books of stamps that you would take to the store to redeem. It was embarrassing for people because others would talk and say 'There are the people lining up for free food again. To this day I will not do that and have others talk about me. To this day I will not eat cornmeal or oatmeal. My mother would make cornmeal bread then she would slice it and fry it.
The Depression years were tough. There wasn't enough work for people. They were having problems at the Woodenware and a short time later it burned. Then my dad did odd jobs until they could rebuild. The kids all had jobs. I was babysitting and cleaning, Roy worked at Kuehne's, June worked for Dr. Brusky and Opal worked for a family at Pauly's Cheese Factory.
20. How much money did you make in those years?
Well when I babysat I got 10 cents an hour, for cleaning it was 15 cents. Mrs. Miller , who lived across the street always paid me a quarter an hour when I worked for her.
21. What were you doing during World War Two?
I was a teenager during the war years. All three of my brothers served. Roy was in Fort Knox Kentucky, Brian was in Texas and Frankie was at Fort Knox also. Two of my uncles fought against the Japanese and one lost a leg. These were difficult times for my mother who worried about the boys.
22. Where did you meet your husband?
I met him at Hauch's Ice Cream Parlor. That was located on the west side of North Main Street next to the hardware store. Then it became Reese's and later Johnson's Restaurant. Roger Gardner was my cousin and he was a police officer at that time. He had a motorcycle and Johnny, my future husband, had a motorcycle. It was a Sunday, my sister June and I went in and I ordered an ice cream float. When we started to leave he bumped me and I got ice cream all over my white dress. I was supposed to have changed clothes, but I didn't. I said, 'How am I going to get home I've got chocolate ice cream all over my white dress?' He said, 'I will give you a ride on my motorcycle.' Well, I had never ridden a motorcycle before. But, Roger said, 'Go ahead.' And that is how we met. After that we rode all over and he even taught me how to drive it.
23. How old were you when you got married?
I was 19 and Johnny was 21. We dated about two years and got married on November 12, 1943. My mom had to go to the courthouse and sign for me because at that time you had to be 21 to get married without your parent's permission. We got married in my house. My sister June and Johnny's brother George stood up for the wedding. Two years later Johnny's brother married my sister June.
24. What changes have you seen in the community over the years?
When I was younger Seymour had many more downtown businesses. I went into all the stores. Everything you needed you could find in Seymour. You didn't have to go into Appleton or Green Bay. Hauck's and later Reese's Dairy were popular spots. They even made their own ice cream and delivered milk to your door. Slowly almost everything disappeared. We didn't have a car so we had to walk almost everywhere. After we were married Johnny's mother had a truck and she would take that to town to get supplies. If they were threshing or something I would drive the truck into town. I couldn't reach the pedals, so Johnny made wooden blocks so I could drive.
25. Did your husband teach you how to drive?
I kind of learned on my own. Back then you didn't need a driver's license. Of course it was a standard transmission so I would practice in the yard. One time I was backing out of the garage and cracked the side mirror. I thought, 'Johnny is going to be mad', but he never said anything until one day he mentioned, 'I must have hit something and cracked that mirror.' He knew I did it, but never blamed me.
26. What were Johnny's parents names?
His dad was Frank and His mother was Kay. His dad died when he was quite young. It was during
the Depression. Johnny never knew him. Johnny's older brothers Pete and George ran the 180 acre farm. When Ed came home from the service they built a house for grandma Holzer. When we lived in the log house on the farm there was no electricity or indoor plumbing. We lived there four or five years. Many of the rural areas around Seymour never got electricity until the late 1940s after World War Two.
27. Where did you live next?
George had a friend in Oregon and he told us how great it was there. So we moved to Oregon, but it wasn't like he said it was. I didn't like it there. It rained every single day. Johnny was gone to work and I missed Seymour and wanted to return. So we came back to Seymour and Johnny got a job operating a farm for an elderly gentleman. When he passed away they sold the place and Johnny worked on another farm near Hoffa Park . After that we moved back into the house of Factory Street and that is when Johnny got a job working for Miller-Piehl and I started babysitting. Jimmy was a freshman in high school and Joann and Carol were in grade school.
28. When did you and Johnny buy the house in Seymour?
When my grandpa passed away I said to Johnny, 'I want to buy that house.' He said, 'How are you going to get the money together to buy it?' We weren't making a lot of money on the farm. So I went down to the bank and talked with Mr. Nichodem. I can see him just as plain as day. He said, 'What can I do for you today?' I replied, 'I want to buy my grandma's house.'
He said, 'How will you pay for it?' I said, 'That's my problem and that is
why I am here. He smiled a little bit. I always liked him. He was such a nice man. My dad said he wanted $4,000.00 for the house. After some discussion we decided I could afford $50.00 a month until the house was paid. It is the white house on the corner of Sally Street and Main Street.
Vera is an amazing woman. Even though she is over 100 years old she continues to maintain contact with the families she babysat for by sending them Christmas and birthday cards. Vera, it was a privilege to interview you. Thank you.